An old friend sent a link to the audio library of Women on the Edge of Evolution. I recognize some of the names — Jean Houston, Barbara Marx Hubbard and other heavyweights of new thought. But scanning down the list I was perplexed by something: none admits to speaking about sex. Perhaps it’s in the audio somewhere; but for none of them is it out front of the conversation in the description of the talk, or the editor who prepared the blurbs overlooked it.
The closest we come is Barbara Marx Hubbard, age 80, who speaks of how “planet Earth’s ‘future female’ indicates new roles, new functions and new capabilities for all women.” She refers to “the evolution of the feminine and the rise of what she calls the ‘suprasexual co-creative impulse’,” but not sex.
I have two questions.
One is, do advanced women think that Humanity or Womanity is going to progress in evolution without the fully conscious, openly embraced ownership of sex and sexuality?
And why would anyone be reluctant to speak about something so basic to existence? Where are the prominent women offering affirmation of the sexual nature of their sisters, encouraging sex education and erotic awareness?
That said, I trust you will get plenty out of these recordings, and I offer them in the orgasmic high-vibe spirit of Venus conjunct Uranus (which if you know the myth is about Old Man Sky getting his balls put back on).
Thank you liminali for your lucid explanation of some things I’ve been feeling about this topic /blog/ etc.
One issue for me has also been the apparent binary mindset of some of the participants – the labeling and polarization. Those not in the “correct mindset” don’t seem to be appreciated as equally valid viewpoints but rather deluded souls who fail to grasp what the more enlightened just know. In general, it’s impossible to feel safe sexually or otherwise if your thoughts and feelings are ridiculed or patronized. (aka, welcome to the typical experience of being female on this planet)
Hopefully we’re all trying to move away from or better see our own fundamentalist tendencies toward a more all encompassing and compassionate place. We have a choice regarding looking to “leaders” of whatever stripe to define the path or we can acknowledge that every person is their own source of light. You don’t need an authority, book, or Oprah or to tell you what you feel or “should feel.” And it doesn’t matter what your t-shirt says (bisexual, monogamous, christian, liberal, PETA, or T-bag). Are you kind? Do you allow others the open space you would like to find? It would be lovely to see PW continue as a forum for many voices, a chorus is divine.
blessed be
Asc., Moon, Neptune – conjunct in Scorpio, Trine Mercury and Chiron conjunct in Pisces, Mars in 8th house
Hi Eric,
Loved your new planets lecture at NCGR conference and coming from a Lilith viewpoint I very much resonate with this post. Sex and spirituality have been divorced from each other in western society. As a feminist and an astrologer I like to talk sexuality in my blogs. But I’ve wondered if I have shied away from it myself.
Do you think Eris could be an archetype to bridge this divide? I’m thinking she could be the merging of science and mysticism, sex & spiritualilty? I still think she resonates with the name the discoverers originally wanted to give her, Persephone. In that she is about bridging two apparently opposite worlds, fertile earth and the underworld. As well as being the famous apple bomb thrower of greek myth. She was also the daughter of Nyx, night.
(Sorry for double post!Namelink wasn’t working. Please delete)
Hi Eric,
Loved your new planets lecture at NCGR conference and coming from a Lilith viewpoint I very much resonate with this post. Sex and spirituality have been divorced from each other in western society. As a feminist and an astrologer I like to talk sexuality in my blogs. But I’ve wondered if I have shied away from it myself.
Do you think Eris could be an archetype to bridge this divide? I’m thinking she could be the merging of science and mysticism, sex & spiritualilty? I still think she resonates with the name the discoverers originally wanted to give her, Persephone. In that she is about bridging two apparently opposite worlds, fertile earth and the underworld. As well as being the famous apple bomb thrower of greek myth. She was also the daughter of Nyx, night.
Long time reader, first time comment. When I first read this piece, I was reminded of an experience with my mother. In the early days of HIV awareness, she and I were watching a PBS program that was an attempt to inform, circa late 80s. Part of the program was interviews with men who were very near death. They were predominately young, white, and gay. One young man was talking about how shocking the experience was for him. He was crying when he made the plaintive, heartfelt statement, “Now sex can kill us!” “Us” being men. He looked very bewildered, sad, fearful, and angry all at the same time. My mother’s response was “Sex could ALWAYS kill women”.
In some way, this experience serves to remind me that men struggle with unconscious male privilege much of the time. One of my initial responses to this article was, Eric is looking not so much in the wrong places, as maybe not looking in the right places. The conversations women share are important parts of who we are as women. Support and education among women does exist, even if you are not privy to it, or do not see it.
I know the statements below really got me thinking.
“I have two questions.
One is, do advanced women think that Humanity or Womanity is going to progress in evolution without the fully conscious, openly embraced ownership of sex and sexuality?
And why would anyone be reluctant to speak about something so basic to existence? Where are the prominent women offering affirmation of the sexual nature of their sisters, encouraging sex education and erotic awareness?”
Upon reflection, I realize these statements really pushed a lot of my buttons. I started examining why they bothered me so much. I think on a very deep level what Eric is trying to offer with PlanetWaves is an invitation to engage in conversation about sex, death, and rebirth. Creation, if you will.
I think some of the reasons the statements bother me is that they use linear, martial, and hierarchical language. It seems to be unconscious, but it’s off-putting in a way that is hard to express.
“I have two questions” OK, but you then proceed to ask three questions. It seems like your expectations are larger than your desire.
“One is, do advanced women think that Humanity or Womanity is going to progress in evolution without the fully conscious, openly embraced ownership of sex and sexuality?”
Jeezus, that’s a loaded question. “Advanced” women? Armies advance, humans evolve. “Humanity or Womanity? Why assume women think in those terms? “Embraced ownership”? Ownership? Really? I embrace my EXPERIENCE of sex and sexuality.
“Why would anyone be reluctant to speak about something so basic to existence?”
Notice the shift from “advanced women” to “anyone”?
There are still many places in our world where women speaking of sex is a threat to their basic existence. What happens to my sister, happens to me. Our bodies often live with the threat or experience of violence in relation to sex. Sex could always kill women. It still can, and it still does. Every single day. For some women, no matter how evolved, there will be times in our lives where speaking about sex is extremely emotionally painful.
And your third question, “Where are the prominent women offering affirmation of the sexual nature of their sisters, encouraging sex education and erotic awareness?”
Again, “prominent women” indicates linear thinking. I know of no one woman who fulfilled all these different needs for me, especially in a public sphere. Your line of reasoning seems based on lack. Your first question has an element of negativity to it, “progress of evolution without”. What would this question sound like framed with positive, inclusive language?
“Do women think that humans are going to progress in evolution to become conscious of experience and open expressions of sexuality?”
Eric, I’m not asking you to change your questions, but to consider how you address those questions when engaging your readers. I’m asking for an awareness that while your questions seem sincere, your wording in this instance doesn’t sound kind, loving, or productive. Words have power, please be gentler with yourself and others.
I see you get angry, and the words “fuck off” were used today in the comments on another post.
My mom was my first sex educator. She used to ask, “why do people say ‘fuck you’ when they are angry? I like fucking; fucking is nice. If people are angry, why don’t they say UN fuck you, fuck you NOT”?
“Sex is natural
Sex is good
Not everybody does it
But everybody should”
Prince Rogers Nelson
peacewaves, PW
Yes, Mystes, I do believe I can.. Let me slip into my thinking cap..
Eric –
And, then there’s Mars sitting on my Leo Moon at 1 degree. . . in my 10th.
Happy Friday.
“Long live the sexual intellectual. Susie B and Betty D are still doing their thing, but we’ve turned a corner generationally. Who’s it gonna be, Eric?”
Wow. Great post/letter!! The bit about ‘actual sexuality’ being beyond the kids coming up is *dead on*. I remember taking my nephew to a multisensory art exhibit when he was 6, and he absolutely refused to slip his hand inside of a tree knothole that had been lined with velvet. Said it was too scary, and when he eventually did so, declared it ‘slimey.’ This was the effect of piling up all sensory experience into the visual cortex, draining the contact senses. Everything tactile/haptic had been beaten down into four or five (threatening) categories.
So who can model something else *beyond the screen*? Melissa, how about you?
M
Eric,
I perused the list you mentioned [in this post].. gawd.. so dry, so straight, still such tidy, missionary femininity. Important articulations for that generation I’m sure, the OGXer’s, Boomers, and older. There are a lot of Boomers and they buy all that spiritual vanilla. They must be very hungry for it, so let them feed.
I think the intellect/sexual split is pretty straightforward, documentable, and obvious, at the very least for reasons of social acceptance. Motherhood and marriage (mostly) creates conservativism, and a myopic sexual politic. The phallus has been conquered, purpose reigns; the holy child supplants desire, and the war, and women are free to wield their newly acquired entitlement, to seduce, finally, with reason.
An autonomous sexual politic, on the other hand, will serve you well if kept private. Otherwise, a crook in the break and the shared air everywhere infuses with a combustible Envy. Sold-out women-wives are often the biggest policiers, here. Is there anything more insidious? Sexual autonomy is an enemy of the state.
The new kids coming up vibe with the inherent autonomy. Actual sexuality though, is too strong for most of these kids, too sensual and too interpretive. Remember, they are robots; the zombie craze is Real. The chill is the turn-on and distance is the new dance. Plus, all their images are in the way. There is no sexual presence unless there’s a representation of sexual presence. Where, where is the hyperlink?
Perversely, er, conversely, The Gen X women are stoked: in their prime, undernourished from day one, and not risking losing this acquired edge anytime soon by falling for that old trick of positioning [our] sexual identities. Or identifying our sexual positions. Attraction is still our power tool but we know knowledge is better. Our bodies may be our Selves, but our minds are free. So all bets are off.
Long live the sexual intellectual. Susie B and Betty D are still doing their thing, but we’ve turned a corner generationally. Who’s it gonna be, Eric?
Thanks for engaging..
Melissa
I am glad you said something about your chart; the 8th is the house of secrets, the occult and that which is used for the purposes of power, by ourselves or others.
The 8th is not “inherently sexual” — it’s about [the hidden, secret mystery of] death, in the first instance; and that which we cede to others, in the second — the dowry (or receive from them, the inheritance). So with such an 8th house, you would not necessarily feel that your sexuality is your own; or your money; and you might fear what would happen if you reveal the “occult” secrets of that house. You might spend a lot of your life searching around places where occult secrets are kept, searching for the mystery of life and death — searching for yourself, or more accurately, for your twin, who is your soul. The way we find the soul is not to slay the body. We have, after all, and I do mean after all, incarnated in a body, to love and create through a body.
Gemini would put two faces on this (adding to the secrecy; in a sense creating double secrecy because the 8th tends to veil, and then Gemini tends to reveal one of its faces to any given audience). We might find you in another place advocating for the open discussion of sexuality and railing against the prevailing secrecy of our times. The 8th also contains our concept of surrender; what prompts, or induces, or leads, or pushes us into surrender. We tend to keep this secret. It would be interesting to peer into your mind in those last 10 seconds before orgasm and see what, ultimately, allows you to let go. I think that is the 8th house at its most beautiful psychic depth.
In some respects the 8th is the power game we play with ourselves (by granting or denying that thing that helps us let go); and at other times it is the leverage we use against others to concentrate power, or try to; but of course there is that point of frustration — dualism. Nothing that we do to others, are we free from. No one truth seems to be true. You constantly gaze into a mirror, looking for that truth, but in reality, looking for your twin self, who is your self, who is you.
Me, or someone like me?
Eric:
I usually refrain from commenting because I don’t like to point fingers. . . but, I do concur with M’s comment: “Someone like you seems to mostly focus on sexuality. It’s your issue, not those women’s issue. They don’t have the same inner need to work things out as you seem to. They are not remiss necessarily.”
As someone with Sun, Mercury, and Mars in the 8th house in Gemini – and Scorpio Rising – I remember you mentioning something about Jonathan Cainer advising you to keep sexuality separate from astrology – and I agree with him.
I also find it interesting that you only display pictures of women (at least from what I’ve observed). Where are the guy pics?
Frankly, I don’t really want to hear from a guy about women’s sexual hang ups – or even mine. But, that’s probably one of my hang ups.
Love the astrology – skip most of the sex stuff.
Hi Magic
I personally express this in photography. But I also do a lot typing…
http://planetwaves.net/pagetwo/?s=grandmother+land&submit=Go
I have noticed that sexuality is an important issue for Eric and this web site, but I find that the larger umbrella of owning and enjoying our physicality seems to ignored or lumped into the sex topic. We have a culture that celebrates the virtue of denial: don’t enjoy actual food (we consume prepackaged poison instead), stay away from the sunshine (get that SPF on your skin – stay inside), exercise at the gym (preferably by watching TV or listening to your music player), chlorinate that water and filter the air. By focusing on sexuality as our sole physical expression, we miss out on sensuality – the joy of connecting with the earth as an earth being – actually enjoying the physical experience.
Well, why would it be that food and sexuality and working as a team with the kitchen crew goes right on the “taken for granted” queue?
I think it’s time to consider carefully the idea that the avoidance of sex and sexuality, and as Mysti points out, desire, are closer to the core of our misery than we admit. When we have no access to our sexual power, which is a prime form of awareness and of curiosity, we are easy to manipulate. We tend to give away what little remaining power we have easily, willingly, and then resentfully.
You can say that I am pointing the finger at women who are new consciousness leaders eschewing the open discussion of sexuality, but what I am doing is observing the obvious. We could say that for life for women is better than it was half a century ago, except for one thing — most still have as their primary agenda finding a man, and many of the older women I have counseled (50+) are still fixated on this agenda.
I am not saying it’s a bad agenda; we all need companionship. But there is not a lot of wind in the sails of actual, self-reflective questioning as to the nature of gender, sexuality and relationship; or the nature of self within these expressions; or of our identity and expectations as men and women who are destined to relate to one another whether we want to or not.
That relating will have consequences, and we need to educate everyone about making conscious choices in the face of all those different potentials.
When I see a group of “new consciousness” women revered as pioneers speaking (among others) to younger women who are much more involved and enmeshed in their sexuality, living in a time of incredible world crisis and imminent change, confronted by the power of their attractions and attractiveness, and more often than not feeling like a victim, I wonder why it is that we’re keeping secrets.
To conceal or hide or veil or cloak or deny or anything of the kind, sexual information and by that I mean in the most ordinary and cosmic sense, I wonder how it is that yet another generation of women is passing on the rite of victimization by perpetuating denial and ignorance.
Is everyone aware that both houses of the Utah legislature have passed legislation that would make it a form of manslaughter for a woman to have a miscarriage? The law is now awaiting the governor’s signature. True, this is in theory about intentionally induced miscarriage. But who is to say? If you fall down the stairs while pregnant and lose your child, that’s horrendous enough; then you might be charged with manslaughter for allegedly having done so intentionally.
We might all agree that’s insane, but what are we doing about it?
http://www.rhrealitycheck.org/blog/2010/02/19/utah-passes-bill-that-charges-women-for-illegal-abortion-or-miscarriage
http://www.amplifyyourvoice.org/u/AFY_Will/2010/2/24/In-Utah-Miscarriage–Criminal-Homicide
http://www.thenewamerican.com/index.php/culture/family/3055-legal-vs-illegal-murder-abortion-in-utah
You know, Eric, when a group gets together to talk about going green in a community, do they talk about the basics like their sexuality or what they are going to eat for lunch and how they are going to treat the lunch staff? When groups get together to move forward an agenda of any kind, the basics like sleep, food, creativity, sexuality seem to be inherent in the cause, to always be working those things to provide ourselves with our maximum capacity for health.
Someone with my focus would always be emphasizing to tell the truth, someone with another focus would be emphasizing to walk everywhere or ride a horse. Someone like you seems to mostly focus on sexuality. It’s your issue, not those women’s issue. They don’t have the same inner need to work things out as you seem to. They are not remiss necessarily.
It’s a basic tenant of psychology 101. Take care of your own business. Don’t point the finger. I need to tell the truth, not make everyone tell the truth. If they lie to me, I just don’t hang with them.
M
I choose Marge because she is a political activist as well as a novelist and poet. She is a visionary of new relationship models. I think that anyone who takes risks, artist or teacher, is in my mind a leader of awareness.
E. I guess I was a little surprised to see Marge Piercy on this list. This is the same MP of “talent is an invention/like phlogiston after the fact of fire”? If we’re going to put novelist/poets on this list, it’ll stretch to Pluto and back. Anais Nin, Erica Jong, Doris Lessing, Isabelle Allende, etc.
As for including Tantric writers in the list… well, it’s complicated. There’s an affiliation between sex and Tantra, but I like to say T is not sex – or religion. It is about integrating desire *consciously* in the sense fields. It’s not to diss sexuality, but to clarify the relationships between perception, longing, orgasm, and their (potential) endgame: Awakening.
I’m starting to drift down the Jane’s Defense argument: sex may actually *be* for making babies. Desire, on the other hand, is much more free-range. It’s for falling and flying.
***
As for you, Miss Larue, you just keep moving that energy around. It’s the only thing people *really* want.
xo
M
I think Z Budapest should be looked at – she has written ten books on the goddess
and in fact she is having a goddess festival this fall….she has a fascinating history.
Her most famous book is probably this one – Holy Book of Womens’ Mysteries
http://www.amazon.com/Holy-Book-Womens-Mysteries/dp/157863413X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1267711815&sr=1-1
Of women who address sex and sexuality directly, I would add:
Betty Dodson
Marge Piercy
Starhawk
Margot Anand
Sherry Winston
Tristan Taormino
Susie Bright
I’ve just started the ‘Tantra in Texas’ meet up here in Austin; negotiating the sudden pitches and rolls of sexual discourse in public is turning out to be more complicated than one might think. When I speak about the power that sometimes translates into pleasure, I have to deal with various incoming images: the Cougar, the Mistress, the Seducer, the (OMFG) Guru.
And, having seen my young’un go recently lurching into these wilds, I am more convinced than ever that a Tantra for Teens needs to be in the works. Now *that* is your really sticky wicket.
I have a young friend who works in a neighborhood store. She asked what I was writing about and I gave her a 3 minute rundown on Tantra. Everyone in the store was under 30, and from the mass physiological recoil, you’d’ve thought I was talking about flaying live kittens.
The High Priestesses don’t talk about S•E•X in serious circles because the deprivation is so intense that to merely invoke the idea that pleasure calls out –as noted by Ms. Birch– a ‘thousand thirsty ghosts.’ Now me, I’m never unhappy to see them since I know they are the hoary little seeds of Awakening. But most women head for the hills.
If you’ve got a ten-foot pole, use it to poke a few holes and plant them.
is it possible for a woman in the public realm to own her sexuality in the public realm?
women know well the undertow
the words were not created in her image
a crack in the nook is a break and
in rush a thousand thirsty ghosts
it’s also class of course, a parroting of patriarchal patterning
the promise of intellectual purification
the recognition of a sexless contribution
is impossible.
the torch is lying there in a lull.
Len! You need to borrow one!?
a friend made me aware of this group last year, and what really stood out for me is how predominantly “white” these evolved/evolving womyn are. it has been my experience that some of the most sexually repressed peoples in our society, are “white” males. not to say that it’s an exclusive club (many have been “whitewashed”, wimmin included), but to me/my experience, a prevalent trend. and of course, just because they don’t talk about it doesn’t mean they don’t do it, but why can’t we communicate? is it still about being “proper” and the “status quo” (i.e., “proper” women don’t fuck, and certainly don’t talk about it!”)? so i’m personally not at all surprised by the lack of dialogue about the topic, considering. to me then, such evolution becomes contextual. again – my opinion – the three biggest problems in our society are the three “taboo” topics – sex, religion and politics. for me, those three issues are basic to my existence and often all i want to talk about (as they are all related). i learned painfully early how i could clear a room by mentioning just one of them, and now i do it just to see who’s left. still not many, but more than before. my 2 cents.
Please, can somebody loan me a Ten Foot Pole?